Comments on: Round and Round She Goes… Where She Stops Nobody Knows http://retheauditors.com/2009/01/28/round-and-round-she-goes-where-she-stops-nobody-knows/ The Business of the Big 4 Audit Firms Thu, 24 May 2012 01:48:07 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: re: The Auditors » Blog Archive » EY Goes To Hong Kong For A Scandal http://retheauditors.com/2009/01/28/round-and-round-she-goes-where-she-stops-nobody-knows/comment-page-1/#comment-154779 re: The Auditors » Blog Archive » EY Goes To Hong Kong For A Scandal Fri, 17 Jun 2011 13:38:00 +0000 http://76.12.174.187/?p=874#comment-154779 [...] NY because sixty professionals had just been cut from their NYC tax practice. In fact, that was a very bad week for EY.  But, other than being sued for the failure of Lehman Brothers (the catalyst for the “financial [...] [...] NY because sixty professionals had just been cut from their NYC tax practice. In fact, that was a very bad week for EY.  But, other than being sued for the failure of Lehman Brothers (the catalyst for the “financial [...]

]]> By: De Minimis http://retheauditors.com/2009/01/28/round-and-round-she-goes-where-she-stops-nobody-knows/comment-page-1/#comment-6166 De Minimis Sat, 20 Jun 2009 21:55:22 +0000 http://76.12.174.187/?p=874#comment-6166 They have some pretty detailed examples on the EDD website regarding this: http://www.edd.ca.gov/UIBDG/Misconduct_MC_5.htm#Refusal of Work Distinguished From Discharge Check out the section regarding "Inefficiency," also the definition of "misconduct." The employer's contention that the firing was "for cause" is considered irrelevant by the EDD. Basically, unless you are meeting the EDD's definition of misconduct, which involves deliberate acts, you will most likely be eligible for benefits if terminated. I They have some pretty detailed examples on the EDD website regarding this:
http://www.edd.ca.gov/UIBDG/Misconduct_MC_5.htm#Refusal of Work Distinguished From Discharge

Check out the section regarding “Inefficiency,” also the definition of “misconduct.” The employer’s contention that the firing was “for cause” is considered irrelevant by the EDD. Basically, unless you are meeting the EDD’s definition of misconduct, which involves deliberate acts, you will most likely be eligible for benefits if terminated. I

]]> By: Anonymous http://retheauditors.com/2009/01/28/round-and-round-she-goes-where-she-stops-nobody-knows/comment-page-1/#comment-6141 Anonymous Sat, 20 Jun 2009 02:36:11 +0000 http://76.12.174.187/?p=874#comment-6141 @19 - I am in CA and my experience is that you have to show the unemployment office that it was a layoff not a firing. But their standard of proof is low and they tend to believe the employee regardless. I agree with you in that your description is what happens... I think the policy though is that you cannot collect if you were fired for cause. It is just that the burden of proof regarding cause is with the firm and the bar is raised very high on what they have to prove. @19 – I am in CA and my experience is that you have to show the unemployment office that it was a layoff not a firing. But their standard of proof is low and they tend to believe the employee regardless. I agree with you in that your description is what happens… I think the policy though is that you cannot collect if you were fired for cause. It is just that the burden of proof regarding cause is with the firm and the bar is raised very high on what they have to prove.

]]> By: De Minimis http://retheauditors.com/2009/01/28/round-and-round-she-goes-where-she-stops-nobody-knows/comment-page-1/#comment-6123 De Minimis Fri, 19 Jun 2009 17:09:48 +0000 http://76.12.174.187/?p=874#comment-6123 BTW, if you're in CA you can collect unemployment even if fired for poor performance, as long as no gross misconduct was involved. I like to keep that fact out there, many aren't aware of it. I think the only exception is if they can prove that you are deliberately underperforming, but they can only do that if you have a track record of high performance. You should always file in any case, for reasons stated in 18. BTW, if you’re in CA you can collect unemployment even if fired for poor performance, as long as no gross misconduct was involved. I like to keep that fact out there, many aren’t aware of it. I think the only exception is if they can prove that you are deliberately underperforming, but they can only do that if you have a track record of high performance.

You should always file in any case, for reasons stated in 18.

]]> By: Anonymous http://retheauditors.com/2009/01/28/round-and-round-she-goes-where-she-stops-nobody-knows/comment-page-1/#comment-6103 Anonymous Fri, 19 Jun 2009 03:43:13 +0000 http://76.12.174.187/?p=874#comment-6103 @13 -- were you able to collect unemployment? Technically, if you are "fired" for cause you are not eligible for unemployment, yet if you are "laid off" you are eligible. In reality, the unemployment office almost always sides with the employee and pays -- even if the employer says it was fired for cause. So -- if you got or are getting unemployment benefits... then by the letter of the law, you were laid off and not fired for cause (i.e., not due to performance). You can hang your hat on that technicality and then use words like those @17 provided... that due to a decline in workload your position was eliminated. @13 — were you able to collect unemployment? Technically, if you are “fired” for cause you are not eligible for unemployment, yet if you are “laid off” you are eligible. In reality, the unemployment office almost always sides with the employee and pays — even if the employer says it was fired for cause. So — if you got or are getting unemployment benefits… then by the letter of the law, you were laid off and not fired for cause (i.e., not due to performance). You can hang your hat on that technicality and then use words like those @17 provided… that due to a decline in workload your position was eliminated.

]]> By: De Minimis http://retheauditors.com/2009/01/28/round-and-round-she-goes-where-she-stops-nobody-knows/comment-page-1/#comment-6050 De Minimis Wed, 17 Jun 2009 20:49:57 +0000 http://76.12.174.187/?p=874#comment-6050 13. I would say that there was a sudden decline in the amount of available work due to the economic downturn, and that your former employer elected to reduce staff. I'm guessing that a lot of people's "performance problems" were concocted in order to achieve this. BTW, it's not big news because it only affects a few people, but PWC has just decided to dissolve its property tax practice. I think it was only active in a few offices, but it was fairly profitable and didn't involve that many staff so I would think it would have been pretty low cost to maintain. One director and one manager in my office are going to be leaving in a couple of months. 13. I would say that there was a sudden decline in the amount of available work due to the economic downturn, and that your former employer elected to reduce staff. I’m guessing that a lot of people’s “performance problems” were concocted in order to achieve this.

BTW, it’s not big news because it only affects a few people, but PWC has just decided to dissolve its property tax practice. I think it was only active in a few offices, but it was fairly profitable and didn’t involve that many staff so I would think it would have been pretty low cost to maintain. One director and one manager in my office are going to be leaving in a couple of months.

]]> By: Anonymous http://retheauditors.com/2009/01/28/round-and-round-she-goes-where-she-stops-nobody-knows/comment-page-1/#comment-6043 Anonymous Wed, 17 Jun 2009 18:35:00 +0000 http://76.12.174.187/?p=874#comment-6043 Confirmed the number. At least 50 staff and seniors in the Northeast, from New York to Boston. Attorneys (JDs and JD/LLMs) hit very hard. Confirmed the number. At least 50 staff and seniors in the Northeast, from New York to Boston. Attorneys (JDs and JD/LLMs) hit very hard.

]]> By: Anonymous http://retheauditors.com/2009/01/28/round-and-round-she-goes-where-she-stops-nobody-knows/comment-page-1/#comment-6009 Anonymous Tue, 16 Jun 2009 23:29:17 +0000 http://76.12.174.187/?p=874#comment-6009 EY Tax NY (and Boston and NJ) is laying off more people tomorrow. Unsure of the number. At least a couple dozen. EY Tax NY (and Boston and NJ) is laying off more people tomorrow. Unsure of the number. At least a couple dozen.

]]> By: re: The Auditors » Blog Archive » Hey Big 4! If I Were You, Here’s What I’d Do (Instead…) http://retheauditors.com/2009/01/28/round-and-round-she-goes-where-she-stops-nobody-knows/comment-page-1/#comment-3673 re: The Auditors » Blog Archive » Hey Big 4! If I Were You, Here’s What I’d Do (Instead…) Mon, 13 Apr 2009 21:41:00 +0000 http://76.12.174.187/?p=874#comment-3673 [...] The largest reductions seem to be at Deloitte and KPMG.  But significant cuts have occurred at EY and have been rumored  to have occurred, although couched in “performance only” language, at [...] [...] The largest reductions seem to be at Deloitte and KPMG.  But significant cuts have occurred at EY and have been rumored  to have occurred, although couched in “performance only” language, at [...]

]]> By: Anonymous http://retheauditors.com/2009/01/28/round-and-round-she-goes-where-she-stops-nobody-knows/comment-page-1/#comment-3191 Anonymous Sat, 28 Mar 2009 05:44:20 +0000 http://76.12.174.187/?p=874#comment-3191 I am struggling on how to answer the following interview question, since I was terminated due to my performance (worked for big4), please help me out. Why did you leave your last position? I am struggling on how to answer the following interview question, since I was terminated due to my performance (worked for big4), please help me out.

Why did you leave your last position?

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